Discussions on the interface

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Discussions on the interface

Postby Parahead » Sat Sep 17, 2005 8:32 am

This is a continued discussion from the Coranto 1.31.2 BETA thread about the Coranto interface.

muttly wrote:* Is there a compelling reason to have the style sheet embedded within the cgi rather than referencing a freestanding external file? I think it would be easier for everyone to maintain and modify their style sheets if it were formated and commented.
Yes, I agree it would be better. Changing this would break the current themes and the Chameleon addon.

muttly wrote:* There are a couple places where I can't tell where an autogenerated table is originating from. (I think this was in your the XMS addon)
This is one of the problems with fooling around with the layout, some stuff are originating from addons. We might end up with a quite funny looking installation if changing the core but not some of the addons to reflect this as well. Then we have the backwards compatibility issue for addons...

muttly wrote:* the autogenerated page bottom navigation is currently output in a format that appends a pipe after each link. The links are compiled from a couple of different sources. I think this would be better if it were redone as an inline list, then assorted CSS styles like those listed here could be easily applied
I agree, but once again, if we change this, the addons that adds a link at the bottom navigation needs to be updated as well.

muttly wrote:* It seems to me that the Main index should be displayed like this rather than it's current line up. I don't know if there are structural reasons for the current line up or if anyone besides me even sees this sort of thing as important enough to bother with.
I like your suggested order, just hasn't thought about it. This one is easy to accomplish, I can change it right away...

muttly wrote:* I'm wondering if it is structurally possible for the Modify News table to be swapped out with an addon. Then we could offer a scrollable alternative something like these

http://www.imaputz.com/cssStuff/bigFourVersion.html
http://www.imaputz.com/cssStuff/bulletVersion.html
Do you really see this as a big issue? I think it could be achieved, needs more investigation though. Maybe with a Yes/No option if this should be enabled or not?

muttly wrote:* I'm wondering if there is any value in adding these Textarea Tools as an option in the CutomFields addon (especially in light of the new GEA addon)
Yes, but this request should go in the addon forum then, not the core forum?

muttly wrote:Since you have mentioned being quite busy I haven't directly solicited any help in stomping my self-generated bugs. Assuming that my work will be judged worthy of inclusion and folded into the next iteration, do you (the core coders) want to splice in my formatting changes or should I send you my adjusted files after the new issues are resolved?

Hopefully over the weekend I will get my current version and notes organized and send out a more complete list my recent thoughts.
Yes, please use the weekend and work things over one more time and then send the adjusted files to me and I can take a look what might work and what might not. As I said above, if we do to much changes addons *will* brake. I would like to thank you for your work so far though... :-D
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Postby Parahead » Sun Oct 09, 2005 9:28 am

I just letting you know that I am currently working on the interface and the things we have discussed above. One thing I like about the Facelift approach is to have headers above a section of options like on the Admin page. The problem is that using this in the 'old' layout with two columns makes it looks kind of dumb when there is three options in each section, since the 'odd' option is placed in the center. I will do some thinking about how to solve this, but it looks better if the odd one is placed to the left...

Another thing I have been thinking about for some time is that the "Change Settings"-page is quite heavy to begin with and becomes heaven heavier when you have a bunch of addons installed and they all "attach" their settings onto that page. My idea is that maybe the settings page could be split into two pages, one with the "general" settings and that would work just as it does now for addons that whish to add settings "the easy way", and the other would contain some of the "Misc" and all of the "Advanced Settings" options (the once related to news handling and building) and be called something like "News Related Settings".

Also, on the Administration page there is quite many setting options available, which makes the page kind of heavy. Maybe the "Change Settings" page should take the user to a new 'overview' page with only the different Settings options available, like "General Settings", "News Related Settings", "Edit User Fields", "Edit File Paths" and "Date & Time Settings".

And why not present the "Full Rebuild" option on the Main page if logged in as administrator? Having Build & Full Rebuild next to each other would seem logical?

I am just throwing out some ideas here to see if you think they are stupid ones? I hope the descriptions made some sense? Feedback?
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Re: Discussions on the interface

Postby bozoka45 » Sun Oct 09, 2005 6:59 pm

Parahead wrote:
muttly wrote:* I'm wondering if it is structurally possible for the Modify News table to be swapped out with an addon. Then we could offer a scrollable alternative something like these

http://www.imaputz.com/cssStuff/bigFourVersion.html
http://www.imaputz.com/cssStuff/bulletVersion.html
Do you really see this as a big issue? I think it could be achieved, needs more investigation though. Maybe with a Yes/No option if this should be enabled or not?


I'm not a big fan of this, I dont want to have to use multiple scroll bars to get to the newsitem.. It should be possible using an addon that just changes the $ModifyNews sub (I think that's it) ever so slightly.

I'm not a huge fan of a new layout, but that's just because I'm used to what Coranto already has. It may, however, make it easier for people new to Coranto to get adjusted.
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Postby muttly » Mon Oct 10, 2005 12:50 am

Apologies for my slack followup the last couple weeks. My house was burgled since I wrote last and it turns out that feuding with street gangs is an expensive and time consuming activity. Believe me, I'd rather be spending my free time addressing this instead.

I'm not a big fan of this, I dont want to have to use multiple scroll bars to get to the newsitem. It should be possible using an addon that just changes the $ModifyNews sub (I think that's it) ever so slightly.


I never intended for it to be a built-in feature, I just wasn't sure if an addon could be written for that section of the code. I get the gist of what is happening in a section of code, but I'm not sophisticated enough as a programmer to understand what is happening on each specific line.

If I were to use it, I would want all the news items to appear on the single screen with no additional pages, not a multiple page listing with a scroll on each. I realize that after certain size this becomes unmanagable, but in a couple of my smaller projects this would have been a nice touch for the end user.

One of the cool things about using CSS is naming items in styles creates built in handles for applying behaviors. I would like to add a javascript toggle option to collapse all the description boxes so people who already know what they are doing don't have to keep scrolling thru them. After I have a solid working CSS layout. it's next on my list of features I hope to contribute.

I'm not a huge fan of a new layout, but that's just because I'm used to what Coranto already has. It may, however, make it easier for people new to Coranto to get adjusted.


I would like to see a 'full build' and a 'help' button added to the global menus, or at least having the option of adding them.

I haven't given up on a CSS version as undoable yet. I will first provide a Coranto Classic layout with only minor tweaks to the generic look & feel you're already familiar with, then offer a facelift like alternative.

The biggest difference would be that the look & feel would largely be controlled by CSS styles rather than embedded table layouts. Structurally, the only code change I need so far is a redundant output of the global navmenu. My CSS seamlessly handles the vertical -> horzontal layout shifts from a user perspective, but the CSS markup required to achieve either option can't happen without the output in 2 places.

The Modify News section is tabular data so it would continue as a table.

I think I'm about 8 input style chunks short of having CSS layouts that test successfully in all modern browsers - WinIE6, Opera8, Gecko's children1.x & Safari. My CSS isn't as straightforward as I would like, but it validates to the extent that is realistic. The few hacks I've employed are well understood and the defacto standard for working around MSIE6's limitations.

Explorer 6 users will have the choice between scrolling classic & facelift. Gecko & Safari users would have either the classic or facelist scroll with the 3rd option of a fixed top for both.

Once I've got a 100% working test case, I'll need to go through and clean up my loose ends and document. This time I didn't try to embed it in the actual code, I just have test case pages that resemble expected output.

I've actually gotten close a couple of times now on proof-of-concept test cases. Most of my problems continue to be Win Explorer bugs, especially related to Explorer's lack of support for the display: table; attribute, though my current sticking point of the moment is a 'float' problem across that fails in all browsers.

I'll try to get some demos up later in the week whether I'm all the way done or not.
Last edited by muttly on Mon Oct 10, 2005 2:22 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby bozoka45 » Mon Oct 10, 2005 2:17 am

Sounds interesting and I'm definately curious to see this work. I'm excited. Just throwing a little fire on what parahead was trying to say, but I for one know that a couple of my addons would need to be updated if the display is updated.
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Postby Jahandar » Mon Oct 10, 2005 3:20 am

bozoka45 wrote:Sounds interesting and I'm definately curious to see this work. I'm excited. Just throwing a little fire on what parahead was trying to say, but I for one know that a couple of my addons would need to be updated if the display is updated.



As long as the hooks for the Misc Addon settings page aren't renamed, shouldn't all current addons work without needing an update for this?

Edit: Looking over the posts in this thread again, I may have misunderstood. I was only thinking in regard to splitting the settings page into separate pages, whereas you may have been referring to some of the other changes being mulled over.
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Big list of WYSIWYG rich text web editors

Postby muttly » Mon Oct 10, 2005 3:50 am

I'm getting ready to take a stab at a GEA install. While I was researching, I found this. It might be a good reesource to add in the documentation.

List of WYSIWYG rich text web editors is being maintained as a general resource for developers who want to add a richer editing experience to web based applications


http://www.geniisoft.com/showcase.nsf/WebEditors

rats. I posted in the wrong place. Somebody please move this to the GEA addon discussion.
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Postby Parahead » Mon Oct 10, 2005 6:28 pm

Jahandar wrote:
bozoka45 wrote:Sounds interesting and I'm definately curious to see this work. I'm excited. Just throwing a little fire on what parahead was trying to say, but I for one know that a couple of my addons would need to be updated if the display is updated.
As long as the hooks for the Misc Addon settings page aren't renamed, shouldn't all current addons work without needing an update for this?

Edit: Looking over the posts in this thread again, I may have misunderstood. I was only thinking in regard to splitting the settings page into separate pages, whereas you may have been referring to some of the other changes being mulled over.
If we do talk about the settings page there will be no need to update addons, they will work just the same and add their settings to the general settings page. Many addons create their own pages with a link at the Administration page, they would not be effected either. If we indeed are talking about something else, could you please elaborate what that is, bozoka45?
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Postby Parahead » Mon Oct 10, 2005 7:00 pm

Another thing, in the sub sub StartFieldsTable (in crcore.pl) the width of the table is 98%, maybe we should change this to 80% instead? Take a look at the "Edit News Fields" (or "Edit News Styles", "Edit Users") page for example, the inputfields at the very bottom of that page is starting far to the left. If changing table width to 80% they will be alligned with the rest of the page above. My guess is that this was the intention from the begining, because at the "Manage Profiles" page (or "Edit User Fields") the input fields at the bottom is created slightly different and at that point a 80% table width is used.

The Submit News page would be alligned in width with the yellow bars if doing this, which I don't see would cause any problems? I have also done a check if there is any addons using this sub and as far as I can tell they should all benefit from this as well, the only one I can see would have a slight smaller "box" than intended is the iSay addon, but it will not look strange, just a little smaller when editing comments.

Feedback on this?
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